Agenda, decisions and minutes

To receive any apologies for absence

Apologies were received from Councillors Stephen Churchman, Annwen Hughes, Linda Ann Jones, Eryl Jones-Williams and Einir Wyn Williams.

The Chair shall propose that the minutes of the previous meeting of the Council held on 28^th September, 2023 be signed as a true record.

The Chair signed the minutes of the previous meeting of the Council, held on 28 September 2023 as a true record.

To receive any declaration of personal interest.

Members had received a briefing note from the Monitoring Officer in advance regarding item 8 - Discretionary Powers to Allow Discounts and / or Raise a Premium 2024-25 and item 9 - Council Tax Reduction Scheme 2024/25.

(1)       Councillor Rheinallt Puw declared a personal interest in item 6 on the agenda - Presentation by the Chair of Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board as he was employed by the Health Board.

The member was not of the opinion that it was a prejudicial interest, and he did not withdraw from the meeting during the discussion on the item.

(2)        The following members declared a personal interest in item 8 on the agenda - Discretionary Powers to Allow Discounts and / or Raise a Premium 2024/25 for the reasons noted:-

·         ⁠Councillor Dewi Jones as a member of the family had inherited a house that continued to be in their possession, and paid the premium.

·         Councillor Cai Larsen as he had inherited a house that had not yet been sold, and was empty.

·         Councillor Huw Rowlands as a close family member had a house that fell into one of the categories.

·         Councillor Gareth A.  Roberts as he had a vacant property with no Council Tax payable on it for 6 months.

·         Councillor Menna Baines as a close family member fell into one of the categories.

The members were of the opinion that they were prejudicial interests, and they withdrew from the meeting during the discussion on the item.

(3)     Councillor Gareth A. Roberts declared a personal interest in item 9 on the agenda - Council Tax Reduction Scheme 2024/25 because a close member of his family had received Council Tax discount.

The member was not of the opinion that it was a prejudicial interest, and he did not withdraw from the meeting during the discussion on the item.

To receive any Chair’s announcements.

Condolences were extended to the following:-

·                The family of Councillor Eirwyn Williams, Cricieth and Councillor Angela Russell paid tribute to him.

·                The family of Carey Cartwright, Learning and Development Manager and Geraint Owen, Corporate Director paid tribute to him.

·                The families of the four young boys from the Shrewsbury area who recently died in a tragic accident near Llanfrothen.

It was also noted that the Council wished to express condolences to everyone within the county’s communities who had lost loved ones recently.

The Council stood in silence as a mark of respect and remembrance.

It was noted that several Council members had been ill recently and they were wished a full and speedy recovery.

The following were

·         The Meirionnydd Young Farmers Federation on coming third in the National Young Farmers Eisteddfod held on Anglesey last month and also for winning the Choir Competition.

·         The team from the Highways and Gwynedd Consultancy Department that had won an award at the NCE in London for using technology to manage assets, namely the Felinheli Flood Prevention scheme and it was pleasing to note that the competition was against major companies across the whole of the UK.

The news was welcomed that the extensive work, over a four-year period, of restoring the Barmouth Viaduct had been completed and it was noted that this was an investment and excellent news for the Cambrian Railway.

To note any items which are urgent business in the opinion of the Chair so they may be considered.

None to note.

To receive a presentation by Dyfed Edwards, Chair of Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board, on the Board’s main priorities in terms of improving services for the people of Gwynedd.

Dyfed Edwards, the Chair of Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board, as well as Carys Norgain, were welcomed to the meeting to give members a presentation on the main priorities of the Board to improve services for Gwynedd residents.

The Chair of the Health Board referred to a paper that had been sent to all members outlining the work of the Board, the challenges and the progress made, and noted:-

·         As the new Chair of the Health Board, that he and other new independent members found an organisation that was unstable, with several challenges surrounding governance, finance and the quality of some services.

·         At the same time, they also discovered that a large number of people worked in the Health Board who did excellent work. Therefore, the first step, when reflecting on the situation, was to try to create stability by undertaking steps to become visible.

·         He believed that it was also fair to say that there were matters relating to the culture of the Health Board and this was one of the things that he personally wished to address, although it was not going to happen overnight.

·         That the Board had a specific work programme, working with people such as Michael West in the field of compassionate leadership, and was very keen to create a context where people could succeed in their work and feel appreciated and part of a broader team that could provide the best possible health and well-being service.

·         That the Board had recently made several key appointments permanent, namely the posts that would create stability in the Health Board and beyond.

·         That the situation was almost similar to creating a new Health Board, and it was important to deliver the requirements of the Welsh Government's special measures, and also address other matters and create success that was going to be sustainable.

·         Therefore, it was hoped that there was a future picture of the Health Board that would be ambitious, but realistic that understood the challenges.

·         That the biggest challenge was access to services and clarity was needed about the way forward and what were the expectations, particularly expectations regarding standards.

·         That there was a risk in a position of special measures to become very defensive but an attempt was being made to do the opposite, and that was one of the reasons why he was proud of this opportunity to address the Council and to be open and transparent about the challenges faced.

·         ⁠That partners, like councils, had a very important role to play with the Health Board on this journey, as health and well-being did not belong to the Health Board alone.  It was believed that there was an opportunity to do more with these partners to deliver what was needed to ensure that the people of Gwynedd and north Wales received the best possible services.

·         That the Health Board would be happy to return before the Council, or any forum of the members' choice, to provide more details about some of the services and  ...  view the full minutes text for item 6.

To consider any questions from elected members, the appropriate notice for which have been given under Section 4.18 of the Constitution.

(The Cabinet Members' written responses to the questions had been published in advance.)

(1)     Question by Councillor Rhys Tudur

Given that Research on New Housing that was published by the Council in 2021 has proved that linguistic assessments on planning applications are untruthful, highlighting that a high percentage of houses have become non-Welsh speaking households in an area that is a traditional stronghold of the language, 68% in Pen Llŷn and 41% in Penllyn, is it not time to overhaul the defective system we have for linguistic assessments so that the language assessor would not act on behalf and for the benefit of the developer, but rather be directed by the Council, with the developer paying commission towards the service?

Response - Cabinet Member for the Environment, Councillor Dafydd Meurig

This work was commissioned in 2019 and this was done as there was a lack of reliable information available about what groups of people tend to move into new houses in Gwynedd, where these people are moving from, and why they are choosing to move to a new house.  As noted in the written response, the main conclusions of the research were as follows:

·           Over 70% of the residents of new dwellings had moved there from another house in Gwynedd.

·           The age profile of people moving into new builds was fairly 'young', with over 70% of the occupiers of new housing being under 45 years old.

·           69% of the occupiers of new housing are able to speak Welsh, which is very similar to the percentage of Welsh speakers across Gwynedd.

In the member's question, it noted that the percentages in Pen Llŷn and Penllyn are lower than the number who speak Welsh in those areas, but there is a need to emphasise that seven areas out of the 10 areas that were included in the research work showed higher percentages as shown in the graph in the written response.  For example, the percentage of Welsh speakers who had moved into new houses in the Porthmadog area was 78%, which compares to 67%, namely the percentage of Welsh speakers in the area.  In Arfon, for example, it was 91% compared to 81%, and very interestingly, in Bangor, it was 59% compared to 42%, namely the percentage of Welsh speakers in Bangor, and this was mainly due to a new housing estate in Goetre Uchaf in Penrhosgarnedd.  And closer to home for me, it was 86% in Dyffryn Ogwen compared to 73% overall.

As part of the research, the chain was also followed in terms of who had moved into the houses as others moved out, and the statistics show that the figures are fairly similar when following the chain.

An important point was that the research included every new house that was completed in Gwynedd between 2015 and 2017, but there were some additional houses going back to 2012 in some areas to ensure that the samples were large enough.

Of course, these housing developments had been  ...  view the full minutes text for item 7.

To submit the report of the Cabinet Member for Finance.

That the Council makes no change to the Council Tax Premium for 2024/25.  That is, for the financial Year 2024/25:-

·         Cyngor Gwynedd allows NO discount on class A second homes, under Section 12 of the Local Government Finance Act 1992;

·         Cyngor Gwynedd allows NO discount and RAISES A PREMIUM OF 150% on class B second homes, under Section 12B of the Local Government Finance Act 1992.

Cyngor Gwynedd allows NO discount on homes that have been empty for 6 months or more and RAISES A PREMIUM OF 100% on homes that have been empty for 12 months or more, under Section 12A of the Local Government Finance Act 1992

The Cabinet Member for Finance, Councillor Ioan Thomas, presented a report asking the Council for formal ratification for 2024/25, of the previous decisions not to allow any discounts for second homes and to disallow discounts on empty properties, and to raise a Premium of 150% on periodically occupied dwellings and a Premium of 100% on long-term empty dwellings.

The Head of Finance then referred to the research work completed during the year to measure the impact of the Premium on individual wards and communities and noted:-

·         In recent months, a reduction had been seen for the first time in the number of second homes and self-serviced holiday units.

·         There was currently not enough data available to prove that this had resulted directly from the Premium. With that, no evidence currently existed that would justify setting a different level for the Premium in 2024/25.

Members were given an opportunity to make observations and ask questions. 

Concern was expressed that the reduction in the number of second homes and the reduction in tourism as a result led to business closures, especially in seaside towns, and it was asked what support the Council could offer local businesses. In response, it was noted:-

·         That the Research and Information Team, that gathered information from several different organisations on behalf of the Council, could bring the data received by the Economy and Community Department together to examine the impact.

·         If the number of second homes was reducing, and people lived in those houses on a permanent basis, it was hoped that those people would support local businesses all-year round.

·         The Council would examine the result of this over a long period.

The recommendation to continue charging a Premium of 150% on second homes was supported on the grounds that people moving into villages such as Abersoch did not understand our language or way of life or were making use of our local businesses, and that people from the area who had inherited houses had to leave their areas as they could not afford to keep hold of those houses.

It was enquired what information was available on the profile of those houses that had changed from holiday homes to permanent residential homes, and whether it was intended to find out if local residents had purchased the houses.  In response, it was noted that this information was not currently available.  Information regarding trends in different areas was available and undertaking this type of research would be the next step.

It was noted that people managed to obtain planning permission to demolish houses and build large houses in their place in areas such as Abersoch, but that local young people could not obtain planning permission to convert farm buildings into a home.  In response, it was noted that this was a planning matter, but the observation was accepted.

It was noted that the reduction in tourism because of charging a premium on second homes would mean that young people would have to go over the border to  ...  view the full minutes text for item 8.

To submit the report of the Cabinet Member for Finance.

1.         That Cyngor Gwynedd’s Local Scheme for the year commencing 1 April 2024 continues as it was during 2023/24. Therefore, the following conditions (a - c below) regarding the continuation of the discretionary elements would continue:

a)    To apply a 100% disregard for war disablement pensions, war widows’ pensions and war widowers’ pensions, for both pensioners and working age claimants.

b)    Not to increase the extended reduction periods for pensioners and working age claimants from the standard four weeks in the Prescribed Scheme.

c)    Not to increase the backdate period for pensioners and working age claimants from the standard three months contained within the Prescribed Scheme.

2.   Where appropriate, to delegate powers to the Head of Finance Department, in consultation with the Cabinet Member for Finance, to make minor amendments to the scheme for 2024/25, on condition that it will not change the substance of the scheme.

The Cabinet Member for Finance, Councillor Ioan Thomas submitted a report asking the Council to confirm the continuation of the current Local Scheme to provide assistance towards paying Council Tax for the year commencing 1 April 2024.

RESOLVED

1.      That Cyngor Gwynedd’s Local Scheme for the year commencing 1 April 2024 continues as it was during 2023/24.  Therefore, the following conditions (a - c below) regarding the continuation of the discretionary elements would continue:

a)      To apply a 100% disregard for war disablement pensions, war widows’ pensions and war widowers’ pensions, for both pensioners and working age claimants.

b)     Not to increase the extended reduction periods for pensioners and working age claimants from the standard four weeks in the Prescribed Scheme.

c)      Not to increase the backdate period for pensioners and working age claimants from the standard three months contained within the Prescribed Scheme.

2.    Where appropriate, to delegate powers to the Head of Finance Department, in consultation with the Cabinet Member for Finance, to make minor amendments to the scheme for 2024/25, on condition that it will not change the substance of the scheme.

To submit the report of the Council Leader, Councillor Dyfrig Siencyn.

To adopt the Language Strategy 2023-2033.

Submitted - the report of the Council Leader asking the Council to adopt a Language Strategy for 2023-2033 as the period of the current Language Strategy (Welsh Language Promotion Scheme in Gwynedd) was coming to an end.

In his presentation, the Leader referred to some successes that had derived from the previous strategy noting that he believed that the Welsh language should fly high in Gwynedd. He also noted that he refused the negativity often heard about the Welsh language in Gwynedd and that this would lead to the extinction of the language.  He noted that the challenge in front of us would have to be faced confidently and inclusively by strengthening the Welsh language, promoting its use and taking pride in the fact that we in Gwynedd, at least, stood strong in terms of the language's future.

Members were given an opportunity to make observations and ask questions.  The following matters were raised by individual members:-

Concern was expressed that only 159 people, and only 3 people under 34 years old, had responded to the consultation on the draft strategy.  In response, it was noted:-

·         It was agreed with the observation and that this was something that should be addressed further.

·         That focus groups had been held at the National Eisteddfod etc. and that the Service collaborated with the Youth Service.

·         There was an intention to improve the technology and that this was also part of the response to obtain the opinion of young people.

It was noted that the report included a lot of rhetoric, but it was easy to praise something without getting down to the nitty-gritty. In that sense, it was noted:-

·         That 34% of respondents to the consultation had noted that they did not know whether the scheme in its entirety would have a positive impact on the Welsh language in Gwynedd.  This in itself was damnable as well as the number of participants in the consultation.

·         There was a lot of aspiring for things that, potentially, could not be measured in the report.  For example, the Measuring Success column in the Actions for October 2023 to October 2024 included many gaps.

·         That Gwynedd was downsizing the immersion provision with the number of days that children were immersed in a language centre reduced from 5 to 4 with the number of specialist teachers who taught in immersion centres halved from 2 to 1 teacher in every centre.

·         That Gwynedd was scared to designate schools as predominantly Welsh-medium ones and that it was possible, in theory, for 40% of children in the county to avoid Welsh-medium education as the category definition we agreed on allowed this.

·         That Gwynedd, unlike other counties such as Anglesey, Denbighshire and Powys, had abstained from funding a transition scheme that gave prominence to the Welsh language in the cylchoedd meithrin.

·         That the strategy was weak in terms of robust measures and that no reference was made to what would happen should those targets not be achieved. 

·         That a reduction had  ...  view the full minutes text for item 10.

To submit the report of the Cabinet Member for Corporate Support.

That the Council instigates a process which could lead to the adoption of a Single Transferable Vote System for Cyngor Gwynedd elections.

Submitted - the report of the Cabinet Member for Corporate Support asking the Council to consider whether a process which could lead to the adoption of a Single Transferable Vote System for Cyngor Gwynedd elections should be commenced.

The Chief Executive and the Monitoring Officer provided a detailed explanation of some aspects of the act and the process.

The Cabinet Member proposed that a process should not be commenced which could lead to the adoption of a STV system for Cyngor Gwynedd elections. 

Members were given an opportunity to make observations and ask questions. 

Although a few members expressed some concerns about the size of wards under the STV system, several other members objected to the proposal on the basis:-

·         That the process needed to proceed for the Council to be able to make a meaningful decision on the way forward.

·         That a STV system exceeded the current electoral system as it was a more contributory, fair and logical system that gave more consideration to people's votes, meaning fewer wasted votes and easier for the voter to use.

·         Unlike most other contributory systems, that a STV system kept a close connection between elected members and their wards and gave more of the power to choose elected representatives in the hands of electors, and less so in the hands of political parties.

·         That one of the main weaknesses of the current system was that it was possible for members to be chosen as councillors unopposed, and the STV system abolished that.

·         That undertaking a consultation would not lead the Council down an irreversible path, but rather offer an opportunity to examine the whole matter and obtain the opinion of electors on it.

·         That the system needed to be revolutionised if our electors were to be empowered, to increase people's interest in democracy, better engage with our electors and have a fairer system, and this is exactly what STV offered.

The Leader presented closing remarks on behalf of the Cabinet Member who had had to leave the meeting early.  Although he supported the principle of having a new voting system for every election, he noted that the Welsh Labour Government's decision not to enforce the system on every council in Wales, as this would weaken the Labour Party's position, was unfair. On this basis, he was not supportive of moving forward with the matter at present.

Members voted on the proposal not to commence a process which could lead to the adoption of a STV system for Cyngor Gwynedd elections.  The proposal fell.

It was proposed and seconded ⁠that the Council commenced a process which could lead to the adoption of a STV system for Cyngor Gwynedd elections.  ⁠The proposer noted further:-

·         That adopting this proposal would be a positive and historic step towards being more democratic.

·         That a STV system removed the idea that there was no point in voting for a specific party and that every vote counted.

·         That the system increased the number of people who got the opportunity  ...  view the full minutes text for item 11.

To submit the report of the Chair of the Strategic Safeguarding Panel.

As it was late in the afternoon to allow a meaningful discussion, this item was deferred.

In accordance with the Notice of Motion received under Section 4.19 of the Constitution, Councillor John Pughe Roberts will propose as follows:-

Considering the impact of discovering tuberculosis on a farm and the importance of infection control, that the Council calls on the Welsh Government to ensure that wild animals who could be transferring the infection in rural areas in the vicinity of an affected farm are tested as a matter of course in order to ascertain whether they are carrying tuberculosis and to permit control measures.

Considering the impact of discovering tuberculosis on a farm and the importance of infection control, that the Council calls on the Welsh Government to ensure that wild animals who could be transferring the infection in rural areas in the vicinity of an affected farm are tested as a matter of course in order to ascertain whether they are carrying tuberculosis and to permit control measures.

Submitted - the following notice of motion by Councillor John Pughe Roberts under Section 4.19 of the Constitution, and it was seconded:-

Considering the impact of discovering tuberculosis on a farm and the importance of infection control, that the Council calls on the Welsh Government to ensure that wild animals that could be transferring the infection in rural areas in the vicinity of an affected farm are tested as a matter of course in order to ascertain whether they are carrying tuberculosis and to permit control measures.

A member expressed his support to the motion on the grounds that it was a step to remove some of the burden from farmers suffering from depression and mental health problems.

RESOLVED to adopt the motion, namely:-

Considering the impact of discovering tuberculosis on a farm and the importance of infection control, that the Council calls on the Welsh Government to ensure that wild animals that could be transferring the infection in rural areas in the vicinity of an affected farm are tested as a matter of course in order to ascertain whether they are carrying tuberculosis and to permit control measures.

In accordance with the Notice of Motion received under Section 4.19 of the Constitution, Councillor Elin Hywel will propose as follows:-

1.    That the Council recognizes our responsibility to protect the well-being and community cohesion of Gwynedd. That we want to see the communities and residents of Gwynedd living together in peace, through mutual respect and support. We see that recent events in Palestine and in Israel have a negative impact on our ability to be successful in fulfilling this responsibility. We see that wars have heart-breaking and disastrous effects here in Gwynedd. We reach out to the residents of Gwynedd at this time. We sympathize and mourn together.

2.    The Council notes our responsibility according to the Well-being of Future Generations Act to play our part to ensure that Wales is welcoming, safe and fair for everyone.

3.    As representatives of the residents of Gwynedd, we call for a peaceful response from the Welsh Government. We call on the Welsh Government, as our representatives on the international stage, to facilitate the establishment and immediate implementation of a humanitarian aid plan for the people of Gaza.

4.    That this motion declares that violence and acts of war against civilians cannot be justified. That this includes the violent actions of Hamas and their refusal to immediately release their hostages, together with Israel's disproportionate actions against the Palestinian people, which are in violation of international law.

5.    That we, Cyngor Gwynedd, call for a permanent and irreversible ceasefire in Gaza. We call on the Welsh Government, the UK and the international community to ensure a return to the negotiating table, and a fair and just solution for all the residents of Palestine and Israel, many who have settled, have family and loved ones here in Gwynedd.

1.    That the Council recognises our responsibility to protect the wellbeing and community cohesion of Gwynedd. That we want to see the communities and residents of Gwynedd living together in peace, through mutual respect and support.  We see that recent events in Palestine and in Israel have a negative impact on our ability to be successful in fulfilling this responsibility. We see that wars have heart-breaking and disastrous effects here in Gwynedd. We reach out to the residents of Gwynedd at this time. We sympathise and mourn together.

2.    The Council notes our responsibility according to the Well-being of Future Generations Act to play our part to ensure that Wales is welcoming, safe and fair for everyone.

3.    As representatives of the residents of Gwynedd, we call for a peaceful response from the Welsh Government.  We call on the Welsh Government, as our representatives on the international stage, to facilitate the establishment and immediate implementation of a humanitarian aid plan for the people of Gaza.

4.    That this motion declares that violence and acts of war against civilians cannot be justified. That this includes the violent actions of Hamas and their refusal to immediately release their hostages, together with Israel's disproportionate actions against the Palestinian people, which are in violation of international law.

5.    That we, Cyngor Gwynedd, call for a permanent and irreversible ceasefire in Gaza.   We call on the Welsh Government, the UK and the international community to ensure a return to the negotiating table, and a fair and just solution for all the residents of Palestine and Israel, many who have settled, have family and loved ones here in Gwynedd.

Submitted - the following notice of motion by Councillor Elin Hywel under Section 4.19 of the Constitution, and it was seconded:-

1.      That the Council recognises our responsibility to protect the wellbeing and community cohesion of Gwynedd. That we want to see the communities and residents of Gwynedd living together in peace, through mutual respect and support. We see that recent events in Palestine and in Israel have a negative impact on our ability to be successful in fulfilling this responsibility. We see that wars have heart-breaking and disastrous effects here in Gwynedd.  We reach out to the residents of Gwynedd at this time. We sympathise and mourn together.

2.      ⁠The Council notes our responsibility according to the Well-being of Future Generations Act to play our part to ensure that Wales is welcoming, safe and fair for everyone.

3.      ⁠As representatives of the residents of Gwynedd, we call for a peaceful response from the Welsh Government. We call on the Welsh Government, as our representatives on the international stage, to facilitate the establishment and immediate implementation of a humanitarian aid plan for the people of Gaza.

4.      That this motion declares that violence and acts of war against civilians cannot be justified. That this includes the violent actions of Hamas and their refusal to immediately release their hostages, together with Israel's disproportionate actions against the Palestinian people, which are in violation of international law.

5.      That we, Cyngor Gwynedd, call for a permanent and irreversible ceasefire in Gaza.   We call on the Welsh Government, the UK and the international community to ensure a return to the negotiating table, and a fair and just solution for all the residents of Palestine and Israel, many who have settled, have family and loved ones here in Gwynedd.

The member set out the context to her motion, noting that:

·         That the BBC reported today that more than 16,200 people, including approximately 7,000 children, had died in the Gaza Strip since 7 October, with thousands more missing under the rubble.

·         She hoped that her fellow members would support her motion to call on the Welsh Government to ensure an intense programme of humanitarian support for the people of Gaza, in the same way as the Council rightly chose to respond to an immense need in the past.

·         That Cyngor Gwynedd has a responsibility to respond to events that affected the residents of Gwynedd, and also a responsibility on a global level as a Welsh public body that is subject to the Future Generations Act.

·         That Gwynedd residents had been greatly affected by the war in Gaza, and that we had to state our viewpoint as a Council to facilitate a healthy, respectful and peaceful culture and to support the well-being development of our communities.

·         With a complete lack of leadership from the Welsh Government and the Westminster Government that we, as Gwynedd Councillors, had to step in and fill the gap for our residents and for peace.

Strong support was expressed to the motion by  ...  view the full minutes text for item 15.

To submit, for information:-

(a)  Update with regard to Councillor Rhys Tudur’s notice of motion to the 4th May, 2023 Council meeting regarding Welsh language provision in secondary schools.

(b)  Letter from the Ministry of Justice in response to Councillor Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn’s notice of motion to the 6th July, 2023 Council meeting regarding the devolvement of powers over justice and the creation of a Welsh Legal Jurisdiction.

Submitted –

(a)       Update with regard to Councillor Rhys Tudur’s notice of motion to the 4 May 2023 Council meeting regarding Welsh language provision in secondary schools.

(b)       Letter from the Ministry of Justice in response to Councillor Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn’s notice of motion to the 6 July 2023 Council meeting regarding the devolvement of powers over justice and the creation of a Welsh Legal Jurisdiction.