Agenda and minutes

To elect a Chair for 2022/2023

RESOLVED to re-elect Arwyn Williams, Head of Ysgol Brynrefail, as Chair of the Forum for 2022/23.

To elect a Vice-chair for 2022/2023

RESOLVED - as no names were proposed for the role of vice-chair, the role would remain vacant for the time being, in order to be able to proceed with the meeting.

To receive apologies for absence.

Apologies were received from Dafydd Gibbard (Chief Executive), Siôn Huws (The Council's Legal Department), Councillor Gwilym Jones (Ysgol Borthygest Governor) and Donna Roberts (Ysgol Hafod Lon).

To receive any declaration of personal interest.

No declarations of personal interest were received.

To note any items that are a mater of urgency in the view of the Chair for consideration.

None to note.

To confirm the minutes of the previous meeting held on 7th February, 2022

The Chair signed the minutes of the previous Forum meeting held on 7 February, 2022 as a true record.

To discuss any matters arising from the minutes.

It was noted that many of the matters had already been included on the agenda.

Report by Kathy Bell, (Schools’ Group Accountant).

The report was submitted by the Schools' Group Accountant, noting that a national pattern appeared in figures until the end of October.  It was confirmed that Gwynedd was the Authority with the highest balances per head in Wales, with no Gwynedd school in deficit.  This was reiterated by the Head of Education, who had been in discussion with the Welsh Government, which had confirmed that the balances were unusually high, and their suggestion of a three-year spending plan.

The Group Accountant noted that £7.5 million would disappear by the end of the year if schemes were not carried out.

It was confirmed that no discussion had been held with individual schools, but the situation was not as promising as balances suggested, as many schools had committed to spend in the new year.  It was noted that there were also additional matters such as salary increases, and an increase in fuel prices that would affect the figures.  It was confirmed that there would be no reduction in the Government's substantial grants.

RESOLVED to accept the report.

Report by Kathy Bell, (Schools’ Group Accountant).

The Schools' Group Accountant reminded the Forum of the substantial grants that had been received over the past two years, compared to this year's grants of £13 million.  It was noted, previously, that a late maintenance revenue grant had been received, but it was confirmed that this was not on the cards this year. 

RESOLVED to accept the report.

Verbal Report by Dewi A Morgan, (Head of Finance)

A presentation was given by the Head of Finance Department, which confirmed that a great deal of the information changed continuously, and that the Authority's Financial Settlement figure would not be available until 14 December.  The Head of Finance Department noted that it appeared that the settlement would be slightly better than what he had feared, and he shared slides with the Forum.  He referred to matters that would affect the settlement such as general inflation of 10/11%, and that homelessness had increased in the county.

In terms of the financial position of the current year (2022/23), it was confirmed that there would be no additional grants, and an overspend of £7.1 million was expected against the Council's budget.  As additional grants could not be used this year, the deficit would have to be filled by using Council balances. The Head of Finance Department referred to a letter that had already been sent to Heads of Department regarding the financial deficit, but it was noted that the deficit may come down slightly.

It was noted that the 2021 census figures were also starting to feed through, and there was some hope that the settlement would be slightly better than what he had anticipated.  It was confirmed that it may be possible to buy time in 2023/24 but, of course, this depended on the Minister's announcement.

Reference was made to options to close the deficit, but there was balancing work to be carried out, especially as the financial position had changed so unexpectedly since the beginning of the current financial year.

Reference was made to the prioritisation system, confirming that the Chief Executive and the Director were examining the individual proposals from each Department, and this would be followed with every Head of Department attending a meeting with the Leadership Team on 19 and 20 December for further discussion. 

The Head of Finance Department referred to modelling cuts from 1% to 6% for schools, and although time could be bought, this was only possible for a period of time.

The Head of Finance Department referred to the procedure and indicative figures with a clear cut across all sectors.  He noted that 6% equated to £4.8 million, but it was emphasised that these were indicative figures.

The need for another meeting at the end of January/beginning of February, depending on

diaries, was noted. 

It was emphasised that these were the worst figures.

The Head of Education Department thanked him for a good and clear presentation, noting that every Department had to prepare, but it was not possible to predict the situation at present.

The meeting was opened for questions / observations:

The Chair noted that showing figures was one thing, but the figures did not reflect the situation and the vulnerability of children who were getting over Covid.  The Head of Education Department noted that work was needed to recover from the impact of Covid on children.  In addition, the Head of Education Department confirmed that he had had to illustrate  ...  view the full minutes text for item 10.

Verbal Report by Rhys M Glyn, (Head of Gwynedd’s Welsh Language Immersion Education System.   

A presentation was given by the Head of Gwynedd's Immersion Education System.  He referred to the meeting held on 28/6/21 where the Education Improvement Grant had been discussed, along with the approval regarding contribution from schools.  He noted the intention to model options in order to consult with schools and the Forum.  He noted that there was no wish to go cap in hand to schools and that it would be possible to find the funding this year, and further discuss how it would be funded at the next meeting.

RESOLVED to accept the information and to receive a further update at the next meeting.

Presentation by Ffion Edwards Ellis, (Assistant Head of Special Educational Needs and Inclusion)

Reference was made to the on-line survey that had been shared in order to receive the observations of Headteachers. It was confirmed that 33 questionnaires had been received, with Model 7 for school budgeting being preferred.  It was noted that observations discussed the impact of Model 7 on school budgets and that they would proceed to undertake more work on Model 7.

It was confirmed that the next steps would look at Model 7 more carefully, and consider the observations, examining the change in April 2023 and then having another discussion about whether the model was suitable. 

The Union Representative welcomed the fact that data quality assurance work was being undertaken with quality officers. 

The Assistant Head of Special Educational Needs and Inclusion noted that work would be undertaken to examine whether or not the emphasis was correct. In addition, when undertaking the modelling work, she noted that it would become clear whether something was wrong. It was confirmed that it would be addressed from the viewpoints of providers.

It was confirmed that an update would be provided at the January/February meeting.

It was asked whether a group examined the work and it was confirmed that a working group existed but new representation was needed.  It was confirmed that Gwynedd was moving forward well and ahead of some nearby counties.

RESOLVED to accept the information and to receive a further update at the next meeting.

Report by Kathy Bell, (Schools’ Group Accountant).

The report was presented by the Schools' Group Accountant, where it was noted that the county was looking at losing 550 primary school children due to a reduction in numbers.  This involved losing £1.2 million in the primary sector over three years. It was confirmed that the Welsh Government was re-examining the Sixth Form Grant, but they may proceed to base it on real figures, and it was confirmed that everything was up in the air. If balances were gone, it was noted that bridging between April and August would be required. It was noted that many things were currently up in the air and that birth statistics appeared to be reducing.

RESOLVED to accept the report.

Report by Owen Owens, (Schools Senior Manager)

The Senior Manager - Education Resources Service reported that eight agreements were coming to the end of their lifespan and that schools had been offered to submit observations, and that they would be discussed in detail at the next meeting.

RESOLVED to accept the report and to receive an update at the next meeting.

To be confirmed

It was confirmed that the next meeting would be held on Monday, 6 February at 3.30pm via Teams. 

The meeting commenced at 3.30pm and concluded at 5.00pm.