Agenda, decisions and minutes

To receive any apologies for absence.

Apologies were received from Councillors Louise Hughes and Sasha Williams; Manon Williams (Parent / Governor Representative Arfon), Karen Vaughan Jones (Parent / Governor Representative Dwyfor), Ruth Roe (Parent / Governor Representative Meirionnydd) and Roger Vaughan (UCAC).

To receive any declarations of personal interest.

No declarations of personal interest were received.

To note any items that are a matter of urgency in the view of the Chair for consideration.

The Chair noted that a request had been received to discuss an urgent matter, and she had scheduled the matter to be discussed during the informal meeting at the end of this meeting.

The Chair shall propose that the minutes of the previous meeting of this committee held on the 20th of October, 2022 be signed as a true record.

The Chair signed the minutes of the previous meeting of this committee held on 20 October, 2022 as a true record.

Cabinet Member – Councillor Menna Jones

To consider a report on the above.

*10.30am – 11.30am

To accept the report and ask the Service to report back on the result of the 'Innovative Procurement - Social Value Procurement Model' pilot, and also collect the data as raised during the meeting, and report back to the committee in a year's time (or when timely).

The Cabinet Member and officers from the Corporate Support Department were welcomed to the meeting.

The report of the Cabinet Member – Corporate Support was presented, following the members' request to receive an update on the progress of the Keeping the Benefit Local project, which was one of the priority projects within the Council Plan.

The Cabinet Member set out the context and the officers provided an outline of the contents of the report.

Members were given an opportunity to ask questions and offer observations. 

Individual members submitted the following observations:-

·         Although the summary at the end of the report stated that good progress had been made over the past five years in terms of increasing the percentage of the Council's expenditure that stays local, It was noticed that the percentage had only increased 3% over this period, and that the figure was down compared with four years ago, and with last year. The member understood the difficulties, but questioned the degree of self-appraisal behind this.

·         It would be useful if data could be gathered regarding the number of local companies who had submitted a tender but were unsuccessful, and what feedback had been given to those companies, and then report back to the committee within around a year.

·         It was important that major organisations in the area, such as Cyngor Gwynedd purchased locally in order to help the economy.

·         The Preston Model was vital, but would not work effectively in Gwynedd since it was an urban model.

·         One of the most important things we can do as a Council is explore how we can enable local companies to join forces and work together, and any investment committed to this would be seen not as a cost, but as a social benefit in itself.

·         It was often said that Wales as a whole had very small businesses, and very big businesses, but not many medium-sizes businesses – it was those medium businesses that would create the largest benefit for our communities.

·         We were all disappointed with the results to date, and want to see ways forward.

On a technical note, and referring to the graph titled 'Annual Local Expenditure' on page 19 of the agenda, a member questioned the accuracy of the £43m figure (capital and revenue) for 2017/18 as it was lower than the £56m figure (revenue only).  An officer confirmed that the figure was wrong.

In response to the observations and questions from members, the following was noted:-

·         In terms of the degree of self-appraisal, Gwynedd was just one of the few Councils that measured this type of activity in terms of keeping the benefit local.  In the presentation at the beginning of the item, there was mention of introducing other measures, and this was in reference to the Well-being of Future Generations Act more than just the local percentage of expenditure.  This figure had stayed quite constant over a number of years, and although a 1% change meant £1.5m of expenditure, it was fairly static.  It was  ...  view the full minutes text for item 5.

Cabinet Member – Councillor Beca Brown

To consider a report on the above.

*11.30am – 12.00pm

*LUNCH BREAK – 12.00pm – 12.45pm

To accept the report and submit an update to the committee when the scheme will have been extended across the primary sector, with specific attention to the work undertaken to raise the numbers and investigate the reasons why some pupils do not take school meals, and ensure that consideration is given to the quality of the food, whilst also seeking to keep the benefit local.

The Cabinet Member and officers from the Education Department were welcomed to the meeting.

Submitted – the progress report of the Cabinet Member for Education on the free school meals project.

The Cabinet Member set out the context and the Senior Schools Manager provided an outline of the contents of the report.

Members were given an opportunity to ask questions and offer observations. 

Individual members submitted the following observations:-

·         Members were surprised that the percentage of pupils choosing free school meals under the schemes UPFSM (Universal Primary Free School Meals) and EFSM (Entitlement to Free School Meals) was so low (70% in September and 66% in October), and expressed concern that schools might miss out on other grants because parents who were eligible to claim free school meals under the EFSM scheme would no longer be doing so, as their children would receive free school meals regardless.

·         The free school meals project in schools was to be welcomed, and the member emphasised the importance of applying political pressure to ensure that the amount per meal received from the Welsh Government was protected, or even increased as we approached a period of cuts.

·         We should celebrate the fact that 1305 UPFSM children who would not otherwise have received free school meals, had chosen school meals in September, which meant that the parents had extra money in their pockets to hopefully spend locally, thus giving a boost to the local economy.

·         Towards the future (accepting that the Department was currently very busy rolling out the project throughout the schools), it could be useful to conduct an annual consultation with parents and children in an attempt to increase the percentage that receive the meals.

·         The meals provided in the schools were balanced and nutritious, but that more flexibility in terms of the choice of food available could be a way of increasing the numbers that have school meals.

·         It was important that the quality of the meals did not suffer as a result of higher costs of producing the meal.

·         Members welcomed the proposal to extend the offer to Year 2 pupils by January 2023.

In response to the observations and questions from members, the following was noted:-

·         The 70% and 66% were average figures across all the county's schools, and the percentage was almost 100% in some schools, with other schools proving to be a much bigger challenge. It was noted further that funding was available to appoint an officer to look into the reasons why children refused school meals, and that this work would focus on those schools where there was a pattern of children who were eligible for free school meals not taking it up.

·         The Welsh Government had identified an amount of £2.90 per pupil for the first phase, based on the average number of pupils who eat school meals in the county. They planned to re-examine this figure for the second phase, which would happen after Easter.  As the cost of producing meals in  ...  view the full minutes text for item 6.

*12.45pm – 1.45pm

*Estimated times

To accept the reports and ask the Education Department and GwE to take note of any observations raised during this meeting.

Cabinet Member – Councillor Beca Brown

To consider a report on the above.

The Cabinet Member set out the context and the Annual Report of the Education Department for 2021-22 was presented.

Members were given an opportunity to ask questions and offer observations. 

Individual members submitted the following observations: -

·         Referring to page 46 of the agenda, a member noted that although there was reference to "carrying out follow-up work over the next year to ensure that the system [Schools' Categorisation according to the Welsh-medium provision] develops and is embedded in order to achieve Gwynedd's ambition in this area", that Gwynedd's ambition was not defined in the context of the categorisation, and that clarity was needed on this.

·         Again, referring to page 46 of the agenda, it was noted that some of the priorities for the next period were superficial, as they referred to 'ensuring' various steps, but did not explain how those steps would be implemented.  The member expressed concern that we would see a further slippage in the number studying Welsh subjects in the Welsh in Education Strategic Plan (WESP), and suggested that we were in a weaker position today than we were in 2016.

·         Concern was expressed that the Census indicated a decrease in the numbers that acquire the Welsh language from a young age, and it was suggested that the Council should be immersing all the children who are not fluent enough in the Welsh language, rather than latecomers only.

·         It was noted that de-registration was a big problem, especially since Covid, and the member asked whether it was possible for the committee to receive data on this, and have the opportunity to scrutinise why young people and families chose to de-register.

·         It was noted that there were many taxi firms from Dwyfor transporting children around schools in Arfon. It was understood that there was a shortage of taxi firms in Gwynedd, but there might possibly be smaller firms who would be keen to tender, but required support to understand the process. It was suggested that this could be examined cross-departmentally by the Economy Department, as a means of supporting small businesses and reducing costs and carbon footprint simultaneously.

·         Concern was expressed that the special schools were already oversubscribed, with Hafod Lon already 10% above its capacity, and the member requested a discussion on this very soon, as the demand would continue to increase.  They also suggested looking into the reasons for the increased demand.

·         It was noted that annual reports talked about the good things and did not discuss the problematic and challenging things - it was difficult to scrutinise a document that tended to only praise.

·         It was noted that the post-16 travel pass was an excellent idea, but it was important that the discussions took place with the train and bus companies to ensure that the services reached the educational establishments on time.

·         Referring to the comment in the report regarding children losing their oral abilities to all intents and purposes as a result of the pandemic, a member noted that they were  ...  view the full minutes text for item 7a

To consider a report on the above.

Officers from GwE were welcomed to the meeting and the GwE Annual Report for 2021-22 was presented.

Members were given an opportunity to ask questions and offer observations. 

Individual members submitted the following observations: -

·         It was noted that it was impossible to scrutinise a report of this size, and that this was not how the committee should be scrutinising the work of GwE.

·         Concern was expressed about children's attitudes towards teachers, and it was noted that prospective teachers should be trained on how to deal with challenging behaviour, otherwise young people would be reluctant to join the profession.

·         It was now very difficult for governors to know what was the baseline for measuring standards in light of Covid, and they believed that there was a role for GwE to play in supporting and assisting them to resume their roles.

In response to the observations and questions from members, the following was noted: -

·         Whilst accepting that the report was lengthy, that more specific reports were presented to the committee during the year at the members' request, but the Annual Report combined everything together in one place.  Should the members wish to focus on certain themes, or discuss more specific elements in workshops, GwE would be more than willing to facilitate that.

·         In terms of addressing the risk in respect of recruitment difficulties and succession planning for securing senior leaders across the region, especially Welsh-medium ones, it was noted that there was much talk about the effect of Covid on pupils, but perhaps the effect on adults had not been fully realised.  Senior leaders across the region were very tired, and a quarter of the secondary headteachers had retired during the last academic year.  Also, as a headteacher left, a deputy or another person would step into the role, which would then leave that role vacant for some time.  It was also noted that during lockdown, headteachers had had to put aside some more 'leadership' elements of the work and focus on managing, safeguarding and ensuring that everyone was safe, but they were now required to step back into the leadership role, or step into that role for the first time in the cases of newer headteachers.   Also, in terms of recruitment, the Welsh-speaking pool was smaller, the world of education was facing the biggest changes in 40 years, and it was a very trying time financially.  In light of all of this, the officer questioned whether these leadership posts were now as attractive to so many people.  In terms of the bilingual ability or Welsh-speaking ability of staff across the region, it was believed that there was balance, but by ensuring that the provision was completely bilingual, perhaps the Service was drawing extensively on the North West pool.  Short-term secondments were one way around this, or buying people's time to fill gaps if specific medium requirements arose.

·         The risk in terms of the consistency and range of the Reform Journey referred to regularity at many levels.  The Department had  ...  view the full minutes text for item 7b